Their name is taken from an early 20th Century European philosophical movement but accusations of intellectual or fake metal may be the least of L'ACEPHALE's worries. Portland, Oregon's L'ACEPHALE's sound draws on influences including neo-folk band Death in June and the Ukraine's Hate Forest, both of whom are allegedly "Ripped on Fascist Ideas". Add to that choral passages appropriated from Orthodox Christian composers like Gorecki and Arvo Part, and you can see why they are a more intriguing proposition than the ideologically confused caustic mush that passes for much modern Black Metal. Founding Member Set Sothis Nox La guides us through his complex project.

Interview written and conducted by Tony Wilson of KNIVES OV RESISTANCE.

CAN YOU GIVE A VERY BRIEF SUMMATION OF GEORGES BATAILLE'S AND HIS L'ACEPHALE FROM WHICH YOU TOOK YOUR NAME?

Georges Bataille was born in France in 1897 he was for the most part employed as a librarian, but was also involved with many art, literary, philosophical, social & movements in Paris and Europe from the 20's through to his death in the early 60's. He was involved with the surrealist movement off and on, mostly as a dissident of said group, having a rocky relationship with its "leader" Andre Breton. He was involved with several journals and political groups related Marxist theories and anti fascist groups; the Democratic Communist Circle, Contre Attaque and several others with French intellectuals, artists and philosophers including Simone Weil, Jacques Lacan, Raymond Queneau, Andre Masson, Robert Desnos, Picasso and many others. Paris at this time was pretty amazing with Saloons seemingly daily where many people and groups met and discussed ideas with regularity. Lectures were open to the public and often carried over to bars and cafes after the lecture proper was over. In these formats he would become enthralled with the writings of Nietzsche and Hegel besides having access to the Bibiloteque National, the major library in France where he worked. He would eventually look back on these overtly political groups, given the eventual occupation of France by Germany, as partial failures. I think that he became disillusioned with political groups as a format for his goals due to many reasons. He felt the fascism of the time carried a major mythological component, which the left did not have.
Thus he became involved with the formation of the Acephale project. A community-oriented group based more on myth and spiritual concerns than overtly political ones. Together with a few intellectuals, writers and artists they collected together to bring back sacred rituals and Myth into modern life, to build a religion, one that was fiercely religious in a Niteztchean manner. Building from an image constructed by Andre Masson and Bataille; a monster, a headless figure, neither man nor god.

"Beyond what I am, I meet a being who makes me laugh because he is headless; this fills me with dread because he is made of innocence and crime; he holds a steel weapon in his left hand, flames like those of a Sacred Heart in his right. He reunites in the same eruption birth and death. He is not a man. He is not a god either. He is not me but is more than me; his stomach is the labyrinth in which he has lost himself, loses me with him, and in which I discover myself as him, in other words as a monster."

Influenced by Nietzsche, it models also his concept of the ubermensch, the over man, but far from the Aryan, Nazi conception. Acephale was paradoxical, spiritual, yet not religious or spiritual in a Christian way, a religion built upon the death of god. Basing their activities in secret, yet also producing several issues of a journal related to the aims of the group. Save Nietzsche from the fascists.
The group and especially the writings of Bataille for the past decade and more have been continually fascinating to me, so with the formulation of this project, given it's intent musically, it seemed perfectly appropriate to unite the series of interests.

YOUÕRE ALSO INFLUENCED BY EASTERN EUROPEAN BM BANDS LIKE HATE FOREST WHO ARE VERY INTO THE IDEA OF ELITISM AND HAVE THE SLOGAN "ANY SUB-HUMAN WHO BUYS ONE OF OUR RECORDS IS BUYING A WEAPON AGAINST YOURSELF": ARE YOU AS CHOOSEY ABOUT YOUR FANS?

Yes and No. I do very much like Hate Forest. Sonically, I think that their music is near perfection in all the things I love about Black Metal. I am not sure how I even stumbled across them but it was before Drudkh. It was certainly the release Purity that held my ear. As far as the statement goes, I think it is an interesting double entendre. The quote is not entirely accurate I think it was "Any sub-human that buys a Hate Forest product buys a weapon against himself."
Pushing the intellectual element of L'ACEPHALE forward not only satisfies my own personal interests but I hope also selects out those people who are not ideologically aligned with it. Also, I thought the strong allegiance to the original group might clear up the philosophical associations of the band contrasting the musical genres of which it is based; Dark Folk and Black Metal. Which I think has met some complications. I suppose it has more due to with peoples trigger finger to judge things based off a knee jerk reaction to references or associations. In specific regards to your question about elitism, I would say that I appreciate the "Art for the Intellectual Elite" sentiment, but not the racialist element.

RIGHTLY OR WRONGLY, HATE FOREST AND DRUDKH ARE SOMETIMES LINKED WITH NSBM. DO YOU THINK THAT THE EXTREME RACIAL IDEOLOGIES OF CERTAIN BM ARTISTS IS UNSURPRISING GIVEN THE EXTREMITY OF THE MUSIC OR IS IT SOMETHING MORE TROUBLING?

Black Metal in general has always been suspect. Undoubtedly the core Norwegian forefathers forged this path. There are both elements of extremity and otherwise that stem from this foundation. People have been drawn to it like, metal in general, that are angry and full of hate and some are N.S. oriented. Plenty of these same metal heads are also fans of metal/rock bands that wear the "Rebel Flag" of the southern states of the U.S. These angry people who are intolerant in metal have always been there, it is a dynamic that has historical precedence, similarly inclined people would listen to blues, rock n' roll and rockabilly all similarly because of it's edgy, "extreme" elements given its place in time regardless of the paradoxical nature that all this music stems from African origins. But I do also think that there are some people who rebel to establish an identity of their own, not content to go along with the norm, thus some people have a tendency to rebel against "politically correct" movements and their rebellion leads them into pursuing such ideologies out of shock value based from their own desire for rebellion. How many people can claim vegetarianism or veganism as "rebellion" or even political activism, when so much of modern life practically embraces it? Not that this anti rebellion-rebellion, if you wish to call it that, is justified, but I do think that some people are drawn to Black Metal and to NSBM in particular as a sweet meat of choice, unspoiled rebellion. In this instance I do think that it is something more troubling.
I have met some people whom I believe traveled down this path early in their life and have now found themselves in a different place, and now they have this dark cloud over them. Certainly, I have been irritated by those political oriented, self-obsessed zombie types, hell bent on being political yet some how clueless as to their social vampirism which completely confounds all their motivations. Or worse, the political alcoholic, the complete drunk who feigns political intentions and really is only interested in libations and has no comprehensive, overarching, political schema at all, or one that is redeeming. I think these sorts of elements are part of what drove Bataille away from certain politically oriented groups and people. It certainly limits my own participation in some activities.

SOME OF THE AMBIENT PASSAGES ON 'MORD UND TOTSCLAG' SOUND LIKE ARVO PART. IS 20TH CENTURY CLASSICAL MUSIC AN AREA OF MUSIC THAT INTERESTS YOU?

Ah yes Part. To even suggest to possibility means you are familiar enough to know. Excellent taste! Certainly I used Gorecki on "Euntes IbantÉ" the sample is actually from the track Amen, not the track of the same name, but I liked the phrase for the overall piece that I constructed and it references back to his work and partially to his motivations. I think is an outstanding piece, I see that piece in particular as an ideological paradox and lament given that I utilized it along with samples of bombs, the WWII speech and the lamenting guitar piece.
I am a fan of Part though, Alina I think, was my first foray into his work. I like a number of ecclesiastical contemporary classical composers. What I really appreciate about these composers are the expressions of their emotive drives and passions through the medium without being limited by the compulsion to sell their music. Perhaps it is more that their drive, spiritually, to attain this musical passion regardless of fame leads them to write some of the most interesting music. Certainly, 20th century classical music is very interesting to me. The work of Pendrecki and Tormis are of equal importance if not more so. In future L'ACEPHALE releases that are near finished you will see more of this. Certainly my association with Carl Annala had a huge impact upon me in this regard. He has been involved with Waldteufel and Earth in the past along with a ton of other bands. He helped seed these interests.

THERE'S AN EXPERIMENTAL NATURE TO SOME OF YOUR TRACKS BUT AT THE SAME TIME IT'S VERY TRUE TO THE CLASSIC BLACK METAL. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF EXPERIMENTAL NOISE ARTISTS LIKE WOLF EYES USING TOYING WITH BLACK METAL DYNAMICS?

The experimental nature was very much a central concern to L'ACEPHALE. Dark ambience ala Death in June filtered through Les Joyeux De La Princesse/Toroidh, Black Metal, and Experimental elements were preeminent. Most of the bands that I love of the past also border this version of Black Metal: A.V.A. (a band from France, which Markus Wolff turned me onto), MZ 412, Abruptum and Burzum. One could say that Celtic Frost and Bathory also had their experimental nature as well. Certainly their ambient pieces reflect this. Mayhem even covered live one of these pieces. I like artists like Kevin Drumm and others who have played with the aesthetics of Black Metal too. Before L'ACEPHALE, I was in a few different Black Metal projects far more experimental, but even before that I had recorded experimental music. In '91 I got my first 4 track cassette multitrack, I was very much into Noise music at the time among many other styles, and have been recording ever since none of it released. So, not knowing the intent of Wolf Eyes proper, I too am entering Black Metal as a wolf in sheep's clothing for those purists who would hate the "blaspheme" of bands like that toying with black metal. If Wolf Eyes intend to strip-mine Black Metal for some kind of street cred, which they do not need, than more power to them. The days of Black Metal being some untouched underground phenomenon is far-gone. It was far-gone when Michael Moynihan published Lords of Chaos. What is it ten years ago?

WHAT'S YOUR VIEW, IF YOU HAVE ONE, ON VISUAL ARTISTS LIKE MATTHEW BARNEY AND BANKS VIOLETTE FLIRTING WITH BM IMAGERY?

My friend Carl Annala introduced me to Matthew Barney, I used to play music with him off and on, and we had an experimental Black Metal band together Hail, which influences Acephale heavily. He had gone to the Cremaster exhibit in New York when he was in grad school. When the films made their way to Portland on the film circuit we saw a few of them together. They are of course stunning and completely amazing. I find it interesting that Barney and Bjork are married as they are in some way closely aligned. She is pretty amazing in my opinion; whenever I stumble across an interview with her I usually read it. She is a fan of Bataille and often mentions him in interviews, but she used to also sell the Eddas in Iceland as a door-to-door salesperson. I have seen some of the art they have done together, but I am not entirely sure which elements you are relating to Black Metal in particular. Certainly, I suppose some elements of the Cremaster Cycle have some of the shock elements of Black Metal. I suppose there is also the Dave Lombardo and bees piece. I have a faint recollection of Carl mentioning that Barney is a metal fan; it would seem so since he chose Dave to do the piece. It certainly embodies the "bees in a bucket" guitar tone that most Black Metal is mentioned as having. I stumbled across Banks Violette very recently in some hip style magazine; I was waiting for coffee on break from work and noticed an interview with Immortal in some art/ hip-hop magazine. Drawn in, I saw photos in a separate article about the recent Violette show with the Sunn o)) amps and equipment in Salt. Some of the other images, the husks of what appear to be blackened church beams were nice. Some other elements were too shiny plastic and modern design for my taste. I like sculpture which is more organic, I liked the church husks because of you could not easily identify the material but some how it seems organic. That piece and the Sunn O equipment made me think of BarneyÕs butter/lard bar installations. In general I like it. Certainly the influence of Black Metal on all mediums is unstoppable, just like the sonic element has had an influence across the board, Black Metal is now almost a household term just like punk in the 80's.

I LIKE THE FACT THAT YOU SEEM PROUD OF BEING WELL-READ, WHEREAS A LOT ARTISTS MAKING BLACK METAL WOULD SEEMINGLY WANT TO CREATE THE IDEA OF BEING AS FAR AWAY FROM CULTURE AS POSSIBLE. WHY DID YOU CHOOSE NOT TO DON FACE-PAINT AND PRETEND YOU LIVE IN A HEDGE OR WHATEVER?

It is hard for me to do something that I do not feel sincere about. Specifically with L'ACEPHALE, which was for me a completely personal project, especially at the time of recording the demo. There were no expectations from the outside, so I just let my personal obsessions run wild.
A lot of people drawn to the more mythological Norway elements of Black Metal are drawn to it like scum punks to G.G. Allin. It is sort of a hero worship. Most punks cannot replicate his level of devotion to his path, but as far as Black Metal goes. It is pretty easy to shadow your work with secret satanic worship and all manner of occult rituals or S & M bedroom antics.
Having been a devotee of Occult literature for years and knowing various people in the O.T.O. and the Church of Satan, I have had the opportunity to join these groups. But I think that the personalities of some of the practitioners and the social games associated with many a group has left me feeling flat. The youthful excitement of being drawn into this "inner sanctum" like when one first reads the writings of H.P. Lovecraft, that there is this real Necronomicon, or if your read the Kenneth Grant material, how just like Crowley received the Book of Law, so too did Lovecraft receive intense dreams which he then wrote down as being transmissions from these entities beyond. This is all great and it is exciting and I have continued to be drawn to it from the outside, but somehow my skeptical side also says it is not true. Perhaps it is best left as a how Robert Anton Wilson describes Magick, as more of a way to interpret and change personal behavior in an active fashion by creating new pathways out of the well driven pathways of the synapses in the mind.
So, where this leads is that it feels a bit dishonest for me to construct a false pretense for the motivations of the band. I do not live in a hedge or some obscure location on the planet. I have performed music in corpse paint, but now it seems a bit sensational. Certainly as a collective, the band all decided that we were not into that, at least for now. I read a ton, but at the same time, I am not trying to state that I have read all that there is, I just read what interests me be it high brow or not. I feel that there is a lot of merit in the avenues of my interests and pose them for others to seek out. Certainly it is better than the boredom and banality most people pursue currently.

I HEARD YOU WORKED AT THE WORLD'S LARGEST BOOKSTORE IN PORTLAND. THAT MUST BE COOL; DO YOU STILL WORK THERE?

I have been working at Powell's Books for about 10 years. I just quit of recent as my wife pursues a graduate degree in another Oregon town. Having worked there has allowed me to seek out all manner of books and thusly has made the prospects of moving a chore! Vinyl records and book collecting makes one dread the potential of moving. AlasÉ I love it. It has been quite nice. Certainly there are the various interpersonal and inter-department shenanigans that are present at any job. I am excited to start pursuing publishing endeavors. So perhaps when I return to Portland I will move in that direction.

AMERICA'S PRODUCED SOME EXCEPTIONAL BM IN RECENT YEARS, WHAT DO YOU THINK IS THE REASON FOR THIS IS AND WHY DO YOU THINK ITÕS NOT AS REGIONAL AS DEATH METAL?

America has finally risen to the occasion. Though I do think there have been bands off and on that have been good. I think that now, instead of imitating the first generation of Norwegian Black Metal, people are now constructing their own visions of the genre. I think that the regional Death Metal aspect was a construction of the time place in which it occurred. Certainly now Death Metal is present everywhere, but in some ways it has been since itÕs inception. I think the Florida scene of which you refer was a collecting together of people at the time to create a scene that was more than tape trading. In those days you had to trade, or hunt down mail orders to get anything. Unless you lived in a major city with a particularly good record store, you were cut off and would likely have no connection. Now with P to P sharing and the internet most people can educate them selves on every aspect of every style of metal easily and download the entire discography of entire sub sets of metal styles only hindered by your connection speed and the size of your hard drive. Which I do not think is bad, but it lends itself to a region-less scene. Localization becomes irrelevant and with modern recording capabilities, your can create anything you want without having to find someone willing to practice double bass for hours to get the ability to create the style of music in the first place.

ARE YOU AT ALL CONCERNED ABOUT USBM EVENTUALLY BEING DISCOVERED AND SCAPEGOATED BY THE CHRISTIAN RIGHT OR WHOEVER?

I believe that there already are Christian Black Metal bands. Was not some of the last Ulver material Christian-esque? It seems that it is inevitable. Sub-Set A rebels against religious group and dominant culture, time passes and Sub-Set A and its derivatives become popular. Then "edgy" Christians or people from Sub-Set A who were Christians return to that religion as prodigal children try to then channel other "lost souls" like themselves, by adopting Sub-Set A cultural production with a new Christian vision. Ugh. Lots of new Christians are pushing the Tattoo aesthetic currently, it is always happening and really I could care less. There are plenty of Black Metal bands I hate or that I love that I do not agree with ideologically. I am not going to try and protect Black Metal in any way, though it is dear to my heart, but the corrupting Christian element or any co-opting seldom warrants any attention and after all I am corrupting Black Metal with Christian Pendrecki, Part and Gorecki. So one could point the finger of accusation at me too in some ways. Black Metal in essence is corrupt being a product of the devil, so what is there to save or protect?